How To Avoid Scams.

Delete, and if I can't delete, ignore.

One thing if you do not have a gallery you can tell them your agent handles your sales and if they are interested you can direct them that way. ( your agent can be a friend ) If it is a scam they won't Persue it most likely. One thing I don't delete or completely ignore it since it might not be a scam and may be a buyer who is unclear as to the proper process.

Good idea for a thread Ronald.

Ronald, i like you in yesterday's exchanges with the person in question, asked for his bonafides and credentials.
After his/her explanation of their business plan, i said, sure check out my work and make me an offer i can't refuse... lol
i never got a response/offer, he only seemed to want to banter to whomever confronted him and tell them that their
work was not what he was looking for. "It did not meet his criteria". So my approach in this particular situation was to offer
myself in hopes he would expose the legitimacy or illegitimacy of his plan or scam.

Ed I thought your immediate response when the thread was posted was great.

1. look up their site. is up to date? who is it registered to? what content is on there?
2. look at their email address - is it from a weirdo site? gmail? look it up, see where else it goes. if its scam related.
3. look up their name, see if they are any place else.
4. listen to their story and see if it makes any kind of sense at all. like the last example where he had secret locations with ultra rich people that had to pay in cash and keep their ID secret because after all it would be bad if people knew they bought art?

5. if you do take the bait, find out:

1. what art specifically they want - not just good large art
2. where did they find you?

i don't have an agent or a gallery. if a person isn't up front with who they are, their website, what they want, and so on, i usually ignore them, unless they chime in here. a real person should be able to answer everything in a professional manner. the scams where they already have a shipper, those just ignore.

if its a real agent - ALWAYS ask for their contract, a sample. they should be able to produce it fast. if they delay, make up excuses why you can't see it, make you commit before you see it etc - run away. then look at that contract carefully and see what terms are. and question everything. if they can answer all your questions, then research them a bit more.


i had one agent contact me with a really bad contract. where i had to supply the art, pay for it all, ship it all, and they (a tv crew decorator), would replace the image, because they would have my digital copy on hand, but the main first image i had to pay for. and if it got damaged, too bad for me.... i had so many questions that he actually cursed me out at the end, said i was no friend of his, and i never heard back from him.... if he was a real legit person, he would try to spin it at least. and convince me he is real.

a con artist like we had yesterday, will either answer a question with a question (a tell that its a lie), or not answer but change the subject, and simply never give a straight answer. always question them if you feel its safe.


---Mike Savad
http://www.MikeSavad.com

The minute "phantom art" said something about cash deals and cash was his reputation, I knew it was NOT legit.

This is a cashless society so there aren't cash deals going on very much anymore. Paypal and credit cards are legit financial transactions and if you can't qualify, it's probably because of criminal trouble. Cash is not king, it's not used...people don't mail others cash anymore and that is simply how it is. I haven't written a check in years.

Also there is the whole tax law thing. One has to follow all those laws to be a legit business. All I ever ask is, "Do you have a business license and are you applying a sales tax?" And if the answer is yes, I know they're legal to do business or trying to be honest. There is no excuse for not following the laws unless you're dealing with something under the table which is criminal.

Being a Federal funded employee, I cannot be a party of any crime whatsoever.

he had me at - i don't have a website, i'm a big gallery that works from hotels only. i would think they were trafficking humans the way he described it. clearly he didn't have a clue how galleries and selling large paintings actually works.

and of course all the PD art and stolen avatar. and of course coming into the thread and raising trouble before introducing himself. and also, not answering simple questions.


---Mike Savad
http://www.MikeSavad.com

Yeah, that was really creepy. "...works from hotels??? What kind of weirdo is he? "Wow!" is all I thought. He showed up on one of my threads but I ignored his response.

Someone told him to stop being an art snob, and I thought to myself more like an art lowlife.

logistically speaking.

mario looks for "a great painter". doesn't matter style, subject etc. buys it, it has to be huge because after all, the bigger it is, the more expensive? then he holds it some place. because if you don't have a real gallery, you have no place to store it. then he rents a room in some hotel, and drags in huge art into it, to maybe sell to clients who might buy it in cash? what if they didn't buy it? he put out $30,000 for a 7ft painting of a giant banana on black, with a huge gold frame, and now what? he rents a warehouse and stores it there? that makes no sense.

with a gallery its all about clearing out the inventory and not letting it sit.

rich person says... i want some art, it doesn't matter the subject, something in the $50,000 range, buy it for me.... that scenario only happens in cartoons.




---Mike Savad
http://www.MikeSavad.com

That was me that told him not to be an art snob because he was baiting people in David King's photo painting thread, saying "you call this art?" He was in that thread and Ronald's green thread before he even started his own asking for artwork for his "gallery". Ridiculous.

Mike interesting thoughts but I am fairly sure it was not Mario. I don't know who it was, but Mario I highly doubt.

Just coming in from the cold...lol....it is 87 degrees this evening.

Ron,

I like your dog. Is he begging?

I think there are legitimate people who need resources. People that are next door neighbors.

In my family our way of thinking is we have a better handle on who in our neighborhood actually needs and benefits from help.

Dave

and you know what would have made a lot more sense? if he said it was being held on a yacht. at least that conjures up being private and exclusive.

no it was mario. the line of not answering questions with a straight answer, always diverting attention, later on going into insults. and of course is laugh jajaja no one laughs like that. and if that is a "spanish laugh" why was he speaking nearly perfect english, and then laugh in spanish? huh? do a search for jajaja and you'll find mostly mario posts. there would be more, but it seems that when some is erased, the threads go with it... i've heard that laugh before which is why i looked, and it was during the jean era.

people have a pattern when they speak, and its something you can't totally correct for. jean was pretty good at changing things up enough to leave people guessing for a bit. but i think he had split personality issues. there is one easy way to know - block the IP of that guy if he comes back, and see if the other is also blocked out. but to come back he would really have to push the joke far, making websites, cards etc. i'm pretty sure we will see other personalities emerge.

i'm pretty good at seeing patterns in things, and i'm certain he was who i think he was. but it hardly matters now....


---Mike Savad
http://www.MikeSavad.com

The whole art world is a scam.

Speak of the devil!

and speak of the devil, what a coincidence. so is this like a beetlejuice thing? we say troll or a magic trigger word and another one comes in?


---Mike Savad
http://www.MikeSavad.com

jinx

---Mike Savad
http://www.MikeSavad.com

What are you people taking about?

we are discussing the topic.


---Mike Savad
http://www.MikeSavad.com

So you agree most of art is a scam?

No, there are of course scams but most artist I know are serious about what they do. They work hard for very little gain.

Let me rephrase that, don't you think that the scum sucking art establishment is mostly a scam?

no

---Mike Savad
http://www.MikeSavad.com

Nicely rephrased!

And there he goes, Marlene!

___________
Susan Maxwell Schmidt
So-so Board Moderator and
Artist Extraordinaire

This is kinda fun. I was always good at Whack-A-Troll. Err, "Mole."

___________
Susan Maxwell Schmidt
So-so Board Moderator and
Artist Extraordinaire

What is it about this thread that keeps attracting trolls?

Think I missed the last one.

I seriously doubt it's more than one! I've recognized phrases that indicates a singular troll who is trying to cover itz trackz. That teenager business was just a rooz.

Nah Ronald, you missed absolutely *nothing.*

___________
Susan Maxwell Schmidt
So-so Board Moderator and
Artist Extraordinaire

I do agree it is one and the same.

Mike...read the OP. It's almost an invite.
How about it if this thread is closed...just a thought.

I am so surprised that this entire thread wasn't taken down. I've seen it happen before.

I personally am enjoying the thread and don't see a reason to close it at this point. I always am interested in why people behave in certain ways whether it is scam types or trolls or whatever!

How adorable...a take off on my name. If anyone doubts who our troll is, just think about who hates me....the guy is so easily intimidated by strong, successful women in the arts....and a political video to boot!!

Ron,
I made a suggestion. Be my guest to turn it into a social experiment.

Next name will be Michael Savage

Oh, come on now "Marla." If you ever come back here again as a legitimate member, you are going to have others who can't stand you. Please quit while you're ahead. Or, maybe it's too late. I don't know. But your behavior is disgusting and juvenile.

Still no real evidence Marlene, perhaps paranoia?

hahahahah...hey guys, time to open up the Happy hour Bar...we can have fun there too.

That's what misogynists do, Mr Marco Carma

keep diggin' yer hole, hon

Marla, Marla, we were friends. And now look what you've done. I am very sad. Not succumbing to any group mentality, but it's very clear you have gone too far. I'm heading over to the bar! Good bye.

Wow, it reminds me of a split personality or a Dissociative disorder.

Ronald, I find it interesting as well. It's almost as if the person is after Marlene...not good. And some are so sure who, but not me. I'm not so sure.

Me too, Patricia.

Speaking of holes, there are a lot of holes in this discussion due to deletions. There is little hope of it becoming a sticky.


Dan Turner
Dan Turner's Seven Keys to Selling Art Online

Dan! That wasn't the kinda holes I was thinking of! lol

Patricia, since you have only wild guesses based on squat I would have to say if this person has been here and would return or if they have never been a member or if they are the person you think they are none of these are provable at this point .

Marlene, who has shown such obsession with you of late.........? This seems to be an all out attack on you.....

Good question Drew.

Ron, sounds like ax grinding to me!

"... based on squat"? That is insulting, Ron. I wouldn't expect that from you. I have conversed with this person for years over in the moderation thread, so I'm pretty sure who it is. If not, then no matter. He is just here to stir up trouble. My bad for getting caught in it.

Give me some real evidence, if it is just circumstantial then it is just more like libel. That is not ok.

I didn't name any names! Just trying to stick up for Marlene. Oh, never mind. No good deed and all that.

:::sigh:::

Since no one seems to want to discuss scams, I guess this thread has run its predictable course. I suggest everyone join Marlene for some SOCIABLE chat.

___________
Susan Maxwell Schmidt
So-so Board Moderator and
Artist Extraordinaire
Also :::pew pewpewpew pewpew:::